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Early video: House fire in Bedford County, Virginia.

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Video from bedfordfd of a house fire yesterday afternoon. Here’s part of the description:

1242hrs- Bedford Communicatons alerted Companies 8 (Moneta), 13 (Stewartsville-Chamblissburg-2nd due), and 1 (Bedford-RIT) to 8646 Dickerson Mill Road for fire in the attic of a private dwelling. Medic 14-8 was the first to arrive to find heavy fire showing from the roof on sides Alpha and Bravo. Wagon 1 (with three) arrived next at 1250hrs and began stretching a line into the interior as Fire Attack Group 1. Engine 13 arrived just behind W-1 and established Dickerson Mill Road command. Ladder 1 (with six) arrived and began the primary search and controlling utilities. The fire was marked under control at 1317hrs.

WSET-TV:

It happened on Dickerson Mill Road in Moneta. It took multiple tankers filled with water and firefighters from c, Stewartsville-Chamblissburg, Bedford, Saunders and Hardy to get this fire under control.

Officials say three people live in the home: A mother, son and grandmother. They say the mother and grandmother were cooking in the kitchen when the fire started. Both were able to get out, and there were no injuries.

One lieutenant with the fire department says oxygen tanks were exploding while they were fighting the fire.

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  • Pingback: On-arrival video: Bedford County House Fire | VAFireNews.com - Fire & EMS News

  • Scooter

    Looks like the pump operator should have been worried about getting water to the hand lines instead of getting the camera up and running!(get the line run 30 seconds or less) Strike Da Box! K

  • SFC

    The guys on the orange line did a great job with their interior aggressive attack.

  • Commenter

    Did someone say bumper turret?

    Seriously, especially in these rural areas, pump and roll bumper turrets would be pretty darned useful. When one guy gets the fire hall, he can pull the piece and knock the fire. No getting out, no futzing around with flaking out the hose, no trying to get the pump in gear. Flip a switch and point the nozzle. Knock the fire on arrival, and then go about your business of IC, search & rescue, extinguishment, water supply, etc.

    • Mack Seagrave

      Commenter: I wish someone whould “Fip a switch” and move all of your posts to a lawn irrigation website. Enough with your insistence that the furture of the fire service rests upon bumper turrets and pump and roll …

      • Commenter

        Actually, the future of the fire service lies with figuring out to pay for something that rarely happens and few people are afraid of. EMS is part of it. The other part is figuring out how to be more effective with fewer people per rig, and more time before the next crew shows up.

        You really can’t get any faster water on the fire than with a bumper turret and pimp and roll. An outside blitz or reset or kill the flashover or transitional attack with one or two guys allows the others to size up and make rescues and buys time for the test of the gang to show up and perform an interior attack.

        • Pedro

          This is a great armchair assessment of the american fire service. Unfortunately it writes off any chance of victim rescue in any scenario other than single story ranches…much less scenarios involving anything on the fire ground that doesn’t involve water and hose…you know, the “other” side of fire fighting…

          The future of the fire service is providing value in our PRIMARY mission, which is to save lives from fire. Once in a while we have to put ourselves in between the fire and the taxpayers. That’s what we swore to do.

          If you can do that from the bumper turret, that’s fine. But for the rest of us that can’t magically transform out 1st due areas to single story unoccupied private dwellings with no exposure hazards, we’ll have to go inside.

      • CHAOS

        I’m still waiting for him to give us the name of his (or any) FD which has adopted all of his revolutionary ideas so that the rest of us may stand in awe of them and learn.

        Should be hundredss of them by now …

    • Anonymous

      Hey Mister Bumper Turret Wiz How the hell do you think the water is going to flow if you don’t put it in PUMP. You probably got all excited when you saw them bring the fan up there also.

  • Tom

    Nice aggressive attack on a well-involved structure. Sounds like the operator had his hands full figuring out water supply. Nice job.

  • Tom

    2-1 3/4″??? That is what that was right?? What was with the guys in the tan gear on the other line changing the pattern on their nozzle every few seconds?? That is one reason I do not like fog nozzles. If you can change the pattern, the inexperienced have a tendency to swap back and forth cuz they just dont have comfort in knowing what works best I guess. Some may say that training on this could prevent these problems, but lets be real, the guys who need the training just are not going to get it. Whether it be because they dont pay attention or the department does not provide the training, it wont get done. Take that option away by giving them a smooth bore that will be putting out the gpm with similar or easier handling characteristics. Just some of my thoughts

  • Jeff

    First armchair on-scene, time 3 minutes in. The roof fell down and then they made entry through the front door?

  • cbj

    Nice aggressive attack? After 35 years in this business I am just a little happy to be getting out. It’s only getting worse. There is nothing “nice” about it. Is it reasonable to beleive this property will be renovated? Or more likely a tear-down? Without spending time on the two 1.75″ lines, and the roof collpase I just go for engine company tactics here. Type of nozzles used besides, when someone calls for “more pressure” it is pretty much due to no previous flow testing and standardized hydraulics. “More pressure” usually equates to more GPM! Next, let’s forget what has long been rule # 1: STAY LOW! and enter a very heavily involved dwelling STANDING UP!How does that happen??? Where is the simple, tried and true common sense? And then to have to give orders for “more line” to a a couple of stiffs just standing there would drive me over the edge. It’s simple, basic engine company work. If your going to advance inside, it’s nozzle, back-up (right behind the nozzle position) and 3rd takes the doorway. Stays low, out of the egress path, and feeds the line while watching for signs of impending overhead fire. Personally, a couple big lines without entry until knock-down, then overhaul. There is nothing left of this structure to justify an interior attack. The time will come, you’ll catch the jobs where good aggressive interior work is indicated and control of a couple rooms with a 1.75″ line (flowing NO LESS than 180gpm) will come your way. But this isn’t it. I see decades of repetative misapplications of tactics, more importantly strategies every day and it’s getting worse regardless of all the information being released and more and more “close calls” due to “unexpected” fire behaviour. I don’t get.

    • Tom

      “The time will come, you’ll catch the jobs where good aggressive interior work is indicated and control of a couple rooms with a 1.75″ line”

      Thanks. I get plenty of work. A big line would have been more appropriate but at least they got in and didn’t stand around outside and yard breath. I see nothing wrong with making entry and putting out fire as progress. I’m sure the guys saved some personal belongings somewhere in the house and the homeowners are grateful for that.

      Continue on gentleman.

    • Tired of Old Salts

      My apologies, but all these years, I’ve been operating on the premises that our jobs were to “protect life and property”. What an idiot I’ve been.I mean, I’ve always thought that trying to save at least a few of the homeowner’s treasured belongings was part of that creedo. By saying that the structure is the only property to be concerned about, you’ve shown me the error of my ways.

      ARE YOU EFFING SERIOUS?!?! Regardless of what you observed, I osberved some very aggressive firefighting with the sole purpose of trying to save what COULD BE saved. I have no dount that the homeowner/taxpayer truly appreciated them not letting it burn down to the slab, likely allowing them to retrieve some belongings that were at least important TO THEM.

      Maybe, after 35 years, you should retire. You clearly don’t understand what we’re fighting for.

    • livindadream

      Well said.

  • cappy

    Tom… Really? Eliminating options for fire stream/nozzle selection is the answer to some percieved problem? They change the pattern to effect a different aplication of the fire stream to match different conditions and needs on the fire ground.That’s a profound and interesting post you have there. I’m going to set aside all my training and experiences and go with your referenced approach to nozzle selection and fire stream application/training. No more reckless mention of the use of fog nozzles around our parts anymore… Maybe we should all just remove all our fog nozzles from service and use nothing but smooth bores in the future.Thanks

    • Curly in CT

      For interior firefighting….that’s the only nozzle to use (SMOOTH BORE).

      • Mack Sagrave

        Smooth Bore: Safest, easiest to use, doesn’t clog with rust, sediment, pebbles, etc., greater stream reach and penetration (acyually places the bulk of the GPM’s onto the main body of fire rather than having the bulk of the GPM’s disipate as steam long before it reaches the main body of fire. Doesn’t envelop the attack team or trapped victims in scalding steam… These are just some of the many benefits of using the smooth bore nozzle for structural fire attack.

  • E1 LT

    “At least they got in and didn’t stand around outside and yard breath. I see nothing wrong with making entry and putting out fire as progress. I’m sure the guys saved some personal belongings somewhere in the house and the homeowners are grateful for that.”

    Are you serious? This must be a joke. The roof had collapsed and you think they did a good job going inside to save some belongings? This is why we have people suggesting fighting fire from the outside. Because we don’t know when to go in and when to stay out. There is no reason to be in there. Sorry, nobody should be killed over trying to save some belongings from obvious flashover and structural collapse.

    Some of these videos, and even worst some of the comments, are painful to watch and read….

    • Rescue5Squad

      Not sure what video you watched, but the roof didnt collapse, it burnt through. This was a nickle and dime fire, and Company 1 handled it as such.

      “Obvious Flashover”…. Didnt see them in danger once. They had a SB with a 15/16″ tip, flowing 185 gpm. Thats more than sufficient for that fire, and they knocked it from the door and went in. Basics.

  • Scooter

    1 3/4 weapon of choice on this job… you see how quick it darkened down from out in the yard. If closer it would have been even quicker. Also a lot easier to move around. Strike Da Box! K

  • ThisGUY

    You guys have nothing better to do than bicker on this site. Nobody ever has the same views on everything, so read, watch, and shut up.

    • Mack Seagrave

      HEY, ‘This GUY': Stop your bickering IMMEDIATELY.

  • Anonymous

    Everyone advocating a 2.5 must not have run with a rural department. Where are you going to get that much water that quick? The object here is to knock it down as much as possible with the water you have until MA shows up.
    In my opinion this was a classic surround and drown job. Why go in under a collapsed roof? They may have seen something we can’t and they may not have known it was empty.

    • Mack Seagrave

      I worked for a municipal department that had an excellent hydrant system and at the same time I volunteered with the local department where I lived. The V.F.D. served a rural area that had no hydrant system. Of course, when a department’s response area is not hydranted they address the issue by bringing the water with them on the apparatus. A tanker / pumper carrying 2,000 gallons can supply an initial blitz with a 2.5″ handline or a ground monitor or a deck pipe. The key when operating with a limited supply of water onscene is to shut down the master stream (or 2.5″ line) as soon as the main body of fire is darkened down. Then smaller lines can be used to complete extinguishment. Remember, in order to extinguish a fire, you must put more GPM’s on it than it can withstand. BTW, two properly supplied 1.75″ lines would be sufficient for the fire shown in this video.

  • livindadream

    Thanks Dave. Another 14:57 of my life wasted watching some truly inexperienced men do a lot of nothing. Why do I waste my time? We are watching the very reason we have 2in/2out, RIC, and all the other PC garbage. These guys had no business going inside. Risk for the sake of risk to look good is stupid. This fire had a big head start, know when to say when. They are lucky nobody got hurt.

    BTW, Thanks for not starting the blower! That could have turned real ugly, real fast.

    • Anonymous

      All of the safety yard breathers are in a huff on this one!

      Did a fireman die? No
      Did a fireman get hurt? No
      Sweet Jesus no one followed the two in two out rule…..we should call the president and alert him

      The safety officers and bean counters are killing the fire service. We have a service to do for the public and that service is to save lives property and the environment. For those of you who are no willing to give your life to save another do us all a favor and quit now.

      For the cross eyed folks who can’t tell the difference the roof burned away not collapsed. Those boys in the black fireman suits did an outstanding job.
      And at the end of this fire all of the firemen went home…..that’s the saying you safety dorks use right? Everyone goes home

  • Cappy

    Measured… Rational…. aggressive…. “Transitional” (read brief defensive tactics going to offensive) to create a tenable fire building allowing members to carry out interior operations is what we should implement on a scene like this. The safe and intelligent tactician would quickly size this up and pretty much do what the guys in the video did….. except………….. the structural integrity would indicated by the roof conditions would dictate that only stable portions of the structure would be entered with extreme caution for the expressed purposes of limited search and rescue ops. Under the circumstances we viewed here, a very cautious measured and planned entry would be advisable. The wholesale go through the door and get BBQed while allowing the roof to fall in on the crew is stupid and just not common sense when there is little to save.
    Risk a lot to save a lot, risk a little to save a little….. risk nothing to save nothing!!! should not be a strange concept to anyone in the fire service.
    Remember…. many of theses structures are insured and the owners will gut and start over or tear it all down and rebuild. These folks would be the FIRST people to tell you not to get hurt but do what you could to salvage some of the stuff that you cant run to walmart and buy… such as some pictures etc…
    Rational aggressive approaches are called for and prudent. That’s coming from a guy that has been career and vol. simultaneously for 31 years. Going “interior” has been the mantra for so long, many of us sometimes forget not every circumstance warrants rushing into the footprint of an incident that can kill you with only the hope of saving some stuff. Yes, I, like many of you have operated that way in the past… I hope more can wise up and operate with a sane approach to safe and intelligent fire ground operations.

  • HOOKMAN

    On the way to this alarm, I’m sure these soldiers saw the column of smoke as they were balling down the 2 lane road repeating to themselves….everyone goes home and of course every fireman’s intial thought, let’s bumper turret this b***h…kudos to the men for putting out the brush fire before this turned into a Malibu, Ca wildland conflaguration event….

  • http://Statter911 Bam Bam

    Am I the only one that saw the FF walk past with the cleanest gear but the dirtiest face @845? I enjoyed the arms flapping around and looking around when he was done getting ready…. almost, tuck in your hood!

  • Marshall

    You guy’s saying that a 2.5 would be a better hose line to use are comical. Those who questioned the 2 in tan gear, they were supposed to be the two out. The roof did not collapse, it was burned off. The crew in black turnout gear were originally dispatched as RIT (3rd due); yet had to change tactics quickly because they found out shortly before arriving that they were going to be first to arrive. What you do not see in this video is the numerous items that were salvaged from the home, which the occupant was truly thankful for. Oh, and the reason why the engine operator did not charge the line immediately was because the nozzle man did not request it.

  • Geoff Tuck

    First let’s note I use my real name not a fake one. Yes I am not afraid of what I do or say. I was on this call.
    First line off was a smooth bore for gpm. Called for more pressure because the strainer was clogged up by a plastic seal the water department uses on the water lines. Roof on the bravo side did fail but access was made on delta side and trusses had good integrity. This home had a lot of valuables and rooms on delta side were saved with some smoke damage. I went in and had no problem with the roof on the bravo side at all. We came and did our job. That’s what we are suppose to do right???? Save life and property. Everyone went home!!!!!
    A lot of people like to arm chair quarter back and that’s fine that’s how we learn sometimes. I am just trying to fix some of the bashing.

    Now for the guy with the dirty face. I believe he was hunting and went straight to the fire house and ran the call. Also he stated that he was the officer on the truck and his crew was taking to long so he was wondering where they were. That’s just what he told me ;-)

  • Jason Overstreet

    The roof didn’t “cave in”. It actually burned off, the guys were able to see that and made their decision. There wasn’t enough water on scene for 2.5″ use. The fan wasn’t started because the gaping hole in the roof, there would be no positive pressure with a hole that size. So the fan would’ve done nothing but waste gas. Over half of the house and its belongings were saved, and the residents were very appreciative. I can’t speak for the changing of the fog nozzle pattern, those guys were on the medic truck, not from our department. The rest of the roof never moved, I watched it very closely. This house is not light weight construction. Its a late 1950’s early 1960’s stick built. Lastly if you’re gonna stand and watch my house burn to the slab because my insurance company will rebuild it, I’m glad my family and myself don’t live in your first due.

  • CDM

    Well Marshall, I won’t argue the tactics. 2 1/2″ lines won’t cut it in rural setting, I’ll give you that. I will, however, point out that the two “out” need to be dressed and ready to enter at a moments notice to save thier brothers. How ’bout some tools too? What good are they if they are not ready? Why not put the neighbors watching as the RIT? Just sayin’

    • Mack Sagrave

      CDM: The department in the video correctly chose an interior attack using (2) 1.75″ lines due to the small size of structure and that it was only partially involved in fire. However, for you to state that 2.5″ hose is not an option for rural firefighters in un-hydranted areas even when conditions call for big water is an invalid statement. (As posted earlier) When a department’s response area is not hydranted they address the issue by bringing the water with them on the apparatus. Automatic mutul aid tanker response coupled with the first due department’s water hauling capability permits the use of whatever type of initial attack is called for. A tanker / pumper carrying 2,000 gallons can supply an initial blitz attack using a 2.5″ handline or a ground monitor or a deck pipe. The key when operating with a limited supply of water onscene is to shut down the master stream (or 2.5″ line) as soon as the main body of fire is darkened down and to have smaller lines stretched and ready to be used to complete extinguishment. Remember, in order to extinguish a fire, you must put more GPM’s on it than it can withstand. Attacking a big fire with undersized lines will allow the fire to burn and continue consuming the structure until the fire has destroyed most of the structure. Basically, attacking a fire using undersized lines (insufficient GPM’s)will result in the fire having the upper hand until it uses up all of the fuel and eventually dies down to a level that the small lines can deal with.

      • (RJ) in florida

        i can go along with you on that becauuse rural requires you to have a plan. in some of my expierences with fires like this in rural depts, you have to expect alot of fires with this much headway SO our plan included both of our first due engines being 1000-1000’s and a duce and a half through the front door for a Quick knock down would not be out of line. Not being able to see the B-C & D side but observing that the fire vented out of the center of the house causes me to go along with a 1-3/4 witht a straight tip for a GPM attack.

        i have been around the job long enough to remember when “running out of water” was a sin but having a good mutual aid arraingement in place works better.

        my chief used to have a saying for our department when it came to rural workers. “bring lots of water. bring it fast and early”…i think they did a good job with what they had. MPO could have been a little better getting water on the orange line but it is what it is

    • Marshall

      Well CDM: The two “out” were from the medic career medic truck. The only tools they carry on the medic truck are flashlights, and A (singular) haligan bar. I agree that they need to be dressed and ready to go; however, our department (Bedford Fire Department) has no control over what they do and do not do on an operational level (training, tactics, etc…). Also, before you say it, the incident commander does have control over that, however, they incident commander was the guy running around without an air pack, unbuttoned jacket, and the red helmet (again, not from our department).

  • http://monetafire.com Geoff Tuck

    Thank you Jason Overstreet for putting your name. If you have balls enough to put replyes have balls enough to put your name. Jason and Marshall are bothe exactly right. Thank you both for your response. Yes something could go way different but that’s the beauty of the video taping. We can see these problems and fix them. Thanks to every one for your response. All of your issues will be addressed. We will start doing a better job of being less aggressive and more lazy. Also I here Bedford is looking at a ARF truck for the turrett.
    Despite what anyone says that was good work and hard work. The officer on that line is very experienced and I trust more than others. I would go with him anywhere. A serious thank you to those that have commented that still believe we are here to do a job and do it the best we can. I guess it’s the new lazy young generation that has read a book about fighting fire and commented about standing outside the fire.

    • Mark Twain

      I am not sure if putting a “real name” on here is indicative of much . . .

      • Jason Overstreet

        I’m not hiding behind my keyboard

        • Mark Twain

          I understand your point.
          My point is that there is no verification of anyone’s name let alone credentials on a “comments section”. Being as such, there is really no difference in what you put for your “name” on here; the only exception is someone stupid enough to give verifiable info on their identity on here and making statements that reflect poorly on themselves and any employer they may work under.

  • Scott

    Evw many of you live in a rural area protected by volunteers? How many of you are on that volunteer dept.? Everyboby’s got a comment. I think the guys did fine for it being a rural fire. Cut ‘em some slack.
    For all you “pro” guys out there from the big city departments, how many of you live in an area protected by volunteer rural departments. If you do, then join that department and help them, they need y

  • WildMonkey1

    pimp and roll bumper turrets right here – 2 of them – Hong Kong – on top of the major pump – or are those Martian landing lights?

    • (RJ) in florida

      could have used that dept that has that 10 miles of 5inch

  • HoodLT

    Line choice correct, making entry correct, entry point correct. I just would have done it faster. Get the man water. And for you backup guys on the line, chase the kinks dont just look back at the pump operator waiting for water like you have no responsibilties yourself. Hey these guys looked better than 3/4 of the crap we see on here everyday.

    Transmit the box

  • JustSayin’

    Well, it could have been worse…

    While burning down a house on Staten Island (NY)
    the FD there sent about 8-members to the hospital.

    • Mack Sagrave

      Ahh yes … “JustSayin'” has stopped by once again to provide his / her baseless bashing of the F.D.N.Y.. I will again ask you, what firehouse in N.Y.C. refused to let you ride with them? Clearly you are not a firefighter as you exhibit no knowledge of firefighting what so ever so I must conclude that you are a ‘scorned fire buff’. One who likely didn’t know how to act around firefighters and as a result was subsequently shown the door. BTW, I’m not against fire buffs at all, I was fortunate to meet many terrific folks over the years who stopped by quarters to chat and a select few who were regulars in our firehouse. Unfortunately, there were the occasional losers like “JustSayin'” who were obnoxious to the point where they found themselves to not be welcome in any firehouse…

      • JustSayin’

        LOL

        Down Crack, DOWN.!!!!
        HEEL.!!!

        Poor ol’ Crack.. The senile junkyard dog for NYFD.

        There was no bashing intended.

        Because many were bashing the Vollies
        I just presenting a fact that, “it could have been worse.”
        And then gave a recent blog example.

        • CHAOS

          “There was no bashing intended.”

          Tell us the one about the Easter Bunny.

          So, why is it that you won’t tell us about why you have such a bone with FDNY? Has someone already hit on it?

          Or, why haven’t you given us examples of FDs that have changed to follow your grand ideas? Or, is it because no one who knows you has bought into all this and now you’re stuck with trying to convert strangers?

          With your previous comments on ethics and morals it would seem automatic that you would be forthcoming with that info instead of hiding such helpful info. Why, that would be rather immoral, wouldn’t it?

          LOL.
          Down, Troll, DOWN!

          • JustSayin’

            I just presenting a fact that, “it could have been worse.”

            And then gave a recent example from this very blog.

            ie: A house burns down and aggressive mas-macho buffoonery injured (8) FFs
            vs. a house burns down with a yard circus with no one injured.

            Simple. Straight forward. “It could have been worse.”

            Unfortunately, ChaosBetweenTheEars hears the Junkyard Dog barking
            and begins to project.

            While it’s so very sad to see, I guess it’s not hard to understand why.

            But on the positive side it does provide a good laugh.!!!

  • cbj

    I have more of a grasp on this job than you think “salts”. I KNOW what we “are fighting for”. For the record I stand corrected and must admit I made the mistake of apllying criticism to a situation that was not what it seemed as far as the nozzle obstruction is concerned. Otherwise I am afraid it will take some time before the masses grasp the fact that what (some) of us did in the early 80’s and such has changed. We were as aggressive as we could every chance we got. The difference is, as we should all know, fire behavior and what is burning…how it burns, etc. Are we reporting more “close calls” now or are we seeing more instances of collapse and flash-over? Did we change from 1.5″ to 1.75″ in the 80’s due to fire dynamics or was it based on reduced staffing and the attempt to increase flows. Reemember after the “war years” ended and we got cut more and more since the policians said we didnt do as much? I got plenty of work to. On both the career and volunteer side. I am an advocate for staying with the basics that make sense…staying low for instance. Choosing the right line (FLOW) for the situation. But I also embarce change and will do everything I can do to prevent anyone under my command from experiencing the horror of skin grafts, pain and disfigurment. For the record I have been burned, had to bail, and screwed up many times during my career. I was never a “yard breather” and am not a “safety sally”. Every item salvaged matters. Absolutely. But that alone does not equate to a reason to make entry on every job. Two 1.75″ lines controlled this job? I’m not going to say otherwise. But to say bigger flows are not effective for “rural” firefighting with limited water supply is a total misunderstanding. As the Brother commented here you can initially increase your flow rate to achieve knock doww without maintaining the constant flow. If the fire is such that the fuel and heat is not contained or controlled by a smaller line or two than whats the point, to just continue hitting the elephant with the bb gun for the purpose of shooting? Stay low, do not enter standing up it makes no sense. If your preconnects are too long for the job required, break-em and use another discharge. Excess hose just gets kinked. Flow test you pumps, each and every discharge. And obstructions will happen! The structure may not be lightweight, I understand that. Modern furnishings and renovations still contribute to today’s problems. But we will still continue to run into those fires where none of these problems exist. Lath and plaster, triple deckers and the like are still plentiful where I am at. If your department was wise enough to know that than I humbly stand corrected. Consider it misapplied criticism. I love these videos, and I hate them too.

  • Ben

    This is just the direction we are headed. If you don’t want to fight fire, you want to stand outside and spray water in the windows.. then quit. You have know business doing the job. The problem with America these days is we have people who want to buy ARFF trucks to fight residential fires; running it. This is why you won’t have a job in a few years…. Obviously the job can be handled with a few guys. Lets roll up and put a shit load of water on this place before we figure out if anybody is inside…. Oh yea… On top of that let’s see if we can ruin everything in there. Do your freakin job. Have some pride in your work. Charge the line get in there and knock it back. Nice job by first in line.

    • Commenter

      Don’t get me wrong, Ben, I like to fight fire. I just want the American fire service to recognize this: putting water on the fire fast is what counts, there are almost no wrong ways to put water on the fire except by venting too much, and there’s no faster way to put water on the fire than from the outside, as soon as you arrive. There’s no faster way to put the water on the fire from the outside when it’s accessible from the front than by engaging the pump as you approach, and using a remote monitor as soon as you get in range.

      You absolutely should be doing a 360 of a building before you commit to entry. You don’t need to do a 360 before you put water through a door or window.

      You need to have a plan to make entry for search and final extinguishment, and need to enact it with urgency as soon as you’ve made your 360, made your action plan, and established your IRIT (2-out). The goal is to get inside and remove any victims. They shouldn’t have to wait for water.

      There’s a nice Pierce in Buena Vista, VA, just up the road from Bedford. You can search for it using terms like “CAFS, Bumper Turret, Pump and roll, 1000 gallon tank”. I am not associated with that department.

  • doobis

    Everyone is aware that one of the key tools insurance uses to gauge property risk in fire is the ISO ratings. Generally, if any structure is more than 5 road miles from the nearest station, that structure is a “Class 10″ – a burn down or total loss structure. If you are less than 5 road miles but do not have a hydrant in so many feet, it is a “Class 9″ – practically a burn down structure.

    It is just the nature of being in a rural area or an area without adequate fire coverage.

    • Commenter

      You’re right on class 10, class 9 is protection by a 300 gallon water tank brush truck, class 8 requires at least 250 gpm for 2 hours, which you should be able to do with a tanker or two.

      Class 7-1 require more water, up to the NFF for the area (houses would be 500-1500 depending on spacing, other buildings up to 3500 gpm for 3 hours), and more equipment, etc. Do get these you’re going to need a fleet of tankers and/or relay pumpers.

      In practice, each tanker is going to give you 150 gpm, and each relay pumper is going to give you 1000 gpm at 2000′ using 5″. You’ll need a few tankers to give you time while the hose gets laid and the shuttle gets started. Or you could just spec large enough tanks on your attack engines.

      There are class 3 departments with no hydrants.

  • Cappy

    Great debate on this one Dave… Keep the videos coming!

    Some will find the “kill the flashover” project information very interesting. Google it and take a look with an open mind. A wealth of info for the firefighter that’s willing to learn something new.

  • Old School

    You can’t compete with the BFDNY. Just ask them, they’ll tell ya.

    • Just

      OOOOOOHHHHH.!!!!!

      THAN IS ABSOLUTELY PERFECT.!!!!!

      BFDNY.!!!!

      LOL

      BFDNY.!!!!!! I LOVE IT.!!!!

    • Marshall

      Yes, ‘Old School’, Just ask us. There have been two self-admitted “BFDNY” firefighters post on this form and one former “BFDNY” firefighter (that resigned because he moved to a different area – Geoff Tuck). We are confident in the fact that the Bedford Fire Department is a very aggressive and knowledgeable department that isn’t afraid to take criticism and or be aggressive. We, at “BFDNY” (BFD) take ownership in what we do and how we do it. We also aren’t afraid to admit that there is a reason why we are “Still 1st” in Bedford County!

  • Floorabove

    Yes!!! Engine 101. Push in the line. Trust your officer to watch your back.