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DC Update: Police union says no to Mayor Gray’s event because of fire chief’s White House flap. Councilmember wants IG to probe cadet harassment charge.

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The head of the police union in DC says his members will join IAFF Local 36 members in not attending Mayor Vincent Gray’s luncheon to honor city workers who helped safeguard the Inauguration. The FOP is taken this action because of DC Fire & EMS Department Chief Kenneth Ellerbe. Kristopher Baumann told Washington Examiner City Hall reporter Alan Blinder, “We’re not going to participate until this administration starts behaving like it’s run by adults and starts treating fellow workers with respect.”

Baumann is referring to Chief Ellerbe’s decision last week to review the cirumstances behind three firefighters appearing in uniform at a White House event with President Obama. Chief Ellerbe issued a statement Friday saying that the initial report by WRC-TV/NBC4 reporter Mark Segraves was not accurate and that discipline was not being considered, though the firefighters were ordered to file reports about the incident. One of those firefighters had publicly battled with Chief Ellerbe last year over multiple changes to the department’s uniform policy.

IAFF Local 36 president Ed Smith also talked to reporter Blinder:

But Edward Smith, the president of the firefighters’ union, said taking part in the celebratory luncheon amid an ongoing review would have sent “a mixed message.”

“It definitely seemed inappropriate,” said Smith, who added that it “remains to be seen” whether the review will lead to discipline.

The White House flap is one of the news stories that prompted Chief Ellerbe to issue three statements within 24 hours last week (and here) claiming reporter accounts in each were inaccurate. One of the other stories was about sexual harassment claims made by cadets at the Training Academy against two instructors. The differences between the story reported by WJLA-TV/ABC 7 and information in Chief Ellerbe’s statement has Council member Tommy Wells asking for an inspector general’s investigation of the matter.


In a letter dated Feb. 26, 2013, Wells asks the inspector general to investigate the allegations. He states that there is wide difference between what fire officials say and what’s being reported by the media.

The story, which was an exclusive ABC7 I-Team Investigation, discovered looming sex scandal in the D.C. Fire Department involving female trainees. Multiple sources told ABC7 that two female cadets recently accused two training academy instructors of sexual harassment.

“We took immediate action to remove those members from the presence of our cadets and continued class,” says D.C. Fire & EMS Chief Kenneth Ellerbe. “The ladies have asked that we keep this matter confidential and we’ve done our best to do that until this matter is completely resolved.”

2013-02-26, Inspector General RE FEMS Harassmment Allegation by DavidKihara


Comments - Add Yours

  • haveyouseenmybaseball?


    • RJ(in florida)

      they should have agreed to go then not showed up

      that would suck to show up to an empty room and lots of food (then release a statement suggesting that they feed it to the homeless) just so they would have something to do

      but thats the evil side of me–good job MPD supporting the FD

  • Mike DCFD

    This is a pattern that is childish behavior from a person who should be leading a Department instead of dictating one. Mr. Mayor open your eyes to see what your FRIEND “lrb” is doing.

    1) Reprimanding members at the scene of a call

    2) Reprimanding members for rolling sleeves up on hot days instead of allowing short sleeves before April

    3) Demoting a well respected BFC because he disciplined members properly

    4) Reassigning BFC’s because they used proper judgment

    5) Disciplining members for wearing coats in cold weather for saying DCFD when he would not issue coats

    6) Ordering Special Reports for members meeting the President

    7) Retaliating against the Union president by Transferring the first Union President ever

    These actions are uncalled for and Moral is at an all time LOW!! We do not want his actions to bring us any lower. The citizens of DC do not want that either. We try to smile and continue to deliver a Grade A on all responses but he is Giving us an “F” for his own vindictive reasons.

    The list goes ON and ON and ON… Please wake up and be a MAYOR of the Nations Capital!!! This makes you look bad.

    • Welcome to our world

      @ Mike DCFD, So lets see, regarding reprimanding members on the scene, if they are wrong or out of compliance than it’s appropriate to do so on the spot.If supervisors as well as the memberships didn’t go around looking so sloppy,than a policy of wearing uniform shirts at all times wouldn’t be in effect.Being well respected doesn’t exclude you from being disciplined.And respected by who? There’s a alot of people who believe he (stern) deserved what he got from past indiscretions.Reassigning BFC because they used proper judgement,well if they did they wouldn’t have been trans ferred.When are you guys going to learn that a chief doesn’t run a department based how the rank and file see fit.Your reasoning doesn’t matter or compute regarding running the department.Basically you want to go about doing business they way you want to (looking like sh@t on runs,operating outside rules and regs,ect..)and have no accountability.Well that’s what it looks like to me,you just want to go on callls throughout your day and be left alone right?.Well my friend no organization operates like that,and if thats what you want or desire,than you need to follow Rubin and Shultz.You can call it what ever you want,but if a chief puts out a policy as long as its legal,you follow it period.No debate or negotiation,if you don’t like it have the union fight it on your behalf.Iknow how this displease some members coming from volunteer houses where there isn’t accountability at all,but this is a paid professional department with real rules,discipline and accountabilty.Do your fu@king job follow the rules and you wont have a problem.You buck the system because you think he(Ellerbe) is going against tradition…well it’s his perogative if he wants to go against the grain.Tradition isn’t always a good thing…don’t confuse common practice as the proper way of doing business.

      • Mike DCFD

        Well first of all the chief should not be reprimanding anyone on a call. That does not show good leadership. You shold not reprimand anyone on the sceane of a call unless it’s concerns Safety. The OIC is responsable. “lrb” too has a chain of command to follow. Notify the DFC or BFC, to reprimand the OIC for allowing a member to not follow the rules. Also you do not disapline someone for past indiscrations as you say. That’s retaliation!!
        It’s a good thing this is not a Corparation for “lrb’s” case because he would have been FIRED along time ago. You can not Shut down companies because your do not want to work anyone on OVERTIME! That is poor management, and puts the Citizens at risk.

      • EXDCFD

        Gotta disagree with some of this. One,any leader worth a shit (leaves LRB out)would have the officer report back to quarters and discipline the men in the firehouse and NOT in public, for that makes EVERYONE look stupid, especially him. Apparatus issues, medic issues and you worry about shirt sleeves on a hot day? Give me a fucking break. Discuss it in the firehouse,NOT in public. YOU ARE WRONG.

        As for Dick Sterne, well when he follows the rules and regs, DPM and any other book of rules and makes a decision, live with it. I’ve known BFC Sterne almost 27 years and I would trust his judgement on many issues. OMFG, there was UNOPENED beer for what almost TWO WEEKS and NEVER touched. Anyone with half a brain (sorry LRB) could make the same decision BFC Sterne made and move on. ESPECIALLY when ALL members on duty pissed clean. “Move on” being the key words. Any Chief worth a shit (LRB is out again!) would back his officer with facts like that. If he can’t, he has issues. THAT has been proven with a ruling in Ed Smith’s favor in his retaliation grievance. How much money will that cost taxpayers, along with any possible sexual harassment lawsuit from the Cadet issue? But hey,he was only looking at her name tag, right?

        Nice stores about BFC Sloan and Capt. Bernie Holt. The list grows on and on. If you cant see that theough the rose colored glasses, take them off.

      • Mike DCFD

        If you think lrb is doing a good JOB then you need to leave with him.

        To put the lives of the citizens of this great City in danger is beyond comprehension. He has placed units out of service because he is watching his overtime budget go up. He knew when the budget came out there was not enough for overtime, he should have asked for more. He needs to hire more Cadet’s, recruits, Medic’s, and Mechanics. Though he thinks we are staffed fine.Fill the Vacancies!!

        Now he is again talking about the power shift for medic units. This will place more Medic unit’s O.O.S. in the evening hours(Risk to Citizens), He places EMS supervisors O.O.S.(Risk to Citizens),we are down grading Medic unit’s on a daily basis(Risk to citizens), Apparatus is piling up at the Shop in need of repair(Risk to Citizens and Members), We have No reserve fleet in case of City Disaster or Terrorist attack(Risk to Citizens)

        This is the Nations Capitol and it seems like we are trying out for the next show on Comedy Cental.

    • Truth Only

      I won’t even address the Lieutenant who should have allowed our “fearless” Union Leaders to …. lead.

      As for transferring Union Presidents you must have 2 years on the job. Tom Tippet was also transferred out of RS1 during his term and Ray Sneed was transferred out of E25. The difference is they were true Union Presidents and didn’t waste tens of thousands of dollars fighting transfers. They had friends and got their assignments back. We make enemies and miss out on a free meal. Okay the free meal part was a joke.

  • Pipeman27

    Eerily quiet


    This picture should be used in every bar, gameroom etc…that has dart boards….

  • Anonymous

    Just what channel can this soap opera be seen on or is it cable only

  • Really Disappointed

    there is a huge contrast in the allegations that the media is reporting and what the fire chief is saying because one of the two sides is lying! i am going to put my money on the professional liar and accused sexual harasser. see, he can sympathize with the accused, so he is going to do his best to cover up these allegations like he wished someone would have done for him in the midst of his own scandal. how much more of this must we endure? ask yourself a question and try to respond honestly. Would this be covered up if the officers being accused were white? in case your having trouble, i will help, NO! is the answer. i really would like to see a bi-racial fire chief get a shot at this job. because the division being created will eventually lead to a catastrophic failure in performance. i have had the pleasure of working with some of the greatest fireman on the planet. black and white we have great guys on this job that would die in order to protect there brothers. i cannot say the same for the previous and current administrations that i have worked under. there has been nothing but contempt and racism going on for far too long. the level of corruption that is going on in this administration has never been achieved or attempted by any fire chief anywhere in the US. It is an embarrassment to a great department and we must move on.

  • Older than Ol’ School

    Based on public photos of the luncheon, primarily it was literally a bus load of National Guard officials that where attendance. It was reminiscent of Chief Ellerbe’s poorly attended State of the Department dog and pony show. I applaud MPD support with DCFEMS (DCFD) against the Gray/EllerbeEllerbe administration. The one MPD office in pix was probably working at the school that day. City officials (Ribero) try to make it seem there were more MPD officers in attendance based on the Washington Examiner article.

  • Older than Ol’ School
  • Barney Miller
    • Ron Stuart

      DAVE can you remove the link from Barney Miller? dosent need to be on this comment board and is meant to poke fun at blacks. im surprised you posted after reviewing-

      • Barney Miller

        Well RON, you super moderator you. That link was attached to the comment I made earlier that dave never cleared. It was a satirical poke at the fact Lon Walls never has “time for dat” when it means doing his hand out…cough cough I mean “Job”. Funny because no one (from FEMS) will comment or go head to head with real issues. Instead we worry about Article XXI, limiting overtime for firefighters and commenting on twitter to reporters. WHEN a mechanic made more in overtime YES OVERTIME than a Step 1 Fire or EMS Captain.FEMALES at the academy are making a serious charge that would have put ME on ADMIN So if DAVE understood the jest I put out I wouldnt have had to sen the link to let him know it was a jest. My way of poking fun at incompetence not black people. If I put Jerry Sinefeld up would I be poking fun of Jews? Get real toolbag.


    Good luck on the Inspector General investigating this or even more comical, the DC Fire Dept’s Internal Affairs….you might as well have 2 mannequins investigating this…..If this were another race of individuals, there would be a full blown investigation and Ellerbe would be calling the media to take the heat off of him…..Since Kenneth has been the recipient of past and present sexual harrassment incidents, he knows how to handle this one….you’ve seen how it was handled…hush hush until….someone drops the dime because you’re a vindictive, incompetent, full of hatred, untruthfull, narcissist and disturbing individual……

    Remember when you or the few left in your corner want to pull someone over and flex your baby muscles, corner an individuall, stop by a firehouse for the sole purpose to intimidate or hold your 60 meetings a day…..the Iphones & Android phones are fully charged and ready to film or record YOU….bet on that….btw way Kenny…that wasn’t nice of you the other day to make a mean face at me and stare me down in front of GRIMKE…you just show who you really are….God fearing and devout Christian my Irish A$$


    @DCFireEMS1 such an angry look as u stared me down Monday am while parking@Grimke #WEdontOPERATEinApaybackENVIRONMENT




    7:07 AM – Feb 27, 2013

  • EastCoastFF

    @WELCOME TO OUR WORLD…… Your seriously SICK in the head. There is only 1 person who supports Kenneth Ellerbe, HIMSELF. So clearly we know who you are. Your “friends” that work at Engine 33 & Truck 8 even talk behind your back and laugh at your hideous management. The DC Fire & EMS Department will flourish someday, long long after you leave.

    • Welcome to our world

      Its funny how you think you know who someone is on this site.BelIeve me I’m not station at E-33 so please stop trying to label someone unfairly.Just like I don’t know who you are(and don’t care to) you don’t know who I am.You guys think that everybody think like you,and if a member doesn’t(” he aint sh@t on the fire ground”). That’s one of your favorite lines,well we know that doesn’t hold 2cents worth of nothing,being though working fires is the least of what we do.I use the handle of Welcome to our world to let all of you know what the hell we went through the last administration.Everything you complain of now,we had issue with back than.But because you had all your people in place,everything was all good.Now the tables are turned you cant handle it.Your isssue with chief Ellerbe isn’t about public safety at all thats a smoke screen.You all want to be able to do what you want and have no accountability period.Your pissed at the chief for getting rid of DCFD,Tshirts,shorts,and polos so fu@king what!(who gives a sh@t).This department needed a chief like Ellerbe along time ago to break up the long standing bullsh@t that has been going on here before you have been thought of.The low morale that you speak of didn’t just start with Ellerbe as one white guy put it(missed the earth by 17,000mi.)Yeah he knows and is the first to tell the the whole truth read his blog.Hookman tells some truth but he has lost site and is caught up in a identity crisis.I don’t along with many others share your thoughts about Chief Kenny Ellerbe because he is trying to change the climate of this department.Sending a certain officer to 10 Engine was the best thing to happen for that house.That would keep them in check,thats what this department needed.The cadet program…the cadet program…since when members of the department (the union included)gave a sh@t about it.When your god Rubin got rid of it,did the union run to there aide,hell no they didn’t.The union pres. is using this prop to keep the press on the chief.Brothers wake up and see whats going on,go back to the rubin era and see what the union did for the cadets.There is no doubt that the union needs an over haul starting at the top.Ed Smith gets a vote of no confidence from me because he doesn’t address real issues.The people who are doing all the complaining on here are the ones who don’t want to do there job. You want to be left alone with no accountability.We know because thats how it was under Rubin.Division within our ranks have been long standing here as AMERICAN APPLE PIE.Not everyone is apart of it,there are alot of members here who dont care about race, so to those I salute you.The appointment of chief Ellerbe has exasperated the long tradition of racial tensions within our ranks.Why? because you no longer have a monopoly running the department,so YOU SAY THIS IS THE WORST ITS BEEN (BULLSH@T).Naturally a child will fall out with a tantrum when he/she doesn’t get their way.For once in your lives deal with the fact that your not in charge and not running the show.We have been use to it for over 400 years,you think we were all right with that?.Chief I know this is a trying time for you,but know this we are here and back you on your quest to change and shape this department.Whether they want to believe it or not but your legacy will live on beyond your tenure.Dont get me wrong here I don’t want anyone to be disenfranchised at all.However the department is more balanced than it has been in my 18yrs on the job.Its not perfect but much better than when Tippet and Rubin ran the department.Contrary to what you may want to believe,I’m by far the last person to be a race batter.But I recognize their is a long standing problem within our ranks.Getting tired now have to work in the morning,don’t try to figure out who you think I am,I could be anyone just like you anonymous.

      • xray

        Damn “Welcome to our world” you are going off someone got you pissed.I think you meant race baiting,figured I correct it because some bloggers tend to be harder on your grammar mistakes when you don’t agree with them.

        • dave statter

          Question for you xray. How did you see Welcome to our world’s comment with “race batting” to comment on it? Is it somehow showing up before I approve them and I don’t realize it or have you hacked my system? Your comment came in at 1:30 a.m. and the comment it is replying to from “Welcome to our world came in at 1:05 a.m. I didn’t approve either for posting until 6:09 a.m. I apologize ahead of time if I am missing something obvious or you are replying to a different comment.


          • Commenter

            Finkle is Einhorn, Einhorn is Finkle!

          • xray

            Sorry Dave no computer hacking here,I see a blog than I comment on it. Computer glitch maybe?

          • dave statter

            No, I wouldn’t accuse anyone of hacking or anything else. You shouldn’t have been able to see that comment until I approved it at 6:09 a.m., yet you responded at 1:30 a.m. Something isn’t right.

      • Twin Tower

        You are bringing race into it. Its the only thing you ever speak of. Why didn’t you mention Thompson in there? Brian how many people under Rubin got in trouble for doing nothing? I’m sure the were all involved i something first, that includes both white and black. I will not support the Cadet program until it is fair. With a city that is almost half white how come no whites have been allowed in?

        • xray

          @ Twin tower,I guess i’ll chime in on this one.I know of several members who had charges trumped upon them from the last administration.The cadet program doesn’t need your blessing to exist,it will be here as long as we have a chief who cares about city youth.I don’t object to any cadet regardless of color coming on this job.As long as they are willing to learn the job,and genuinely care about helping people we swore to protect.One of the reasons the cadet program existed back in the day was because of racial bias,unfair exams to name a few.If not for the cadet program the demographics of the department would look like the 1960’s.Marion Barry conjured up the program to give city youth a chance to learn a great profession, and to give back to their community.I don’t believe the fire service appeal to many white city youth,being though most come from well to do families.Do you know of any white males or females who have applied and were denied admission to the cadet program.Black youth are not the only members benefitting from the program.There have been several hispanics who have joined our ranks as cadets.I donot object to anyone coming on through the program as long as they are from the city.

          • Twin Tower

            I also know several white members who had charges trumped up by Rubin. Each one of these members had done something wrong to get the ball rolling. I guarantee that no member who comes to work on time and does their job, goes home and does the right thing doesn’t have to make the claim that they got trumped up charges.

            The cadet program is racist. Its a place for members to get their kids on the job. There are plenty of white kids who would love this opportunity to be in this program, hell one even had to sue the city. It could be a great program but its not. The testing process is unfair it gives city residents an extra 5 points.

            The only reason you like lrb is because of race. His crowning achievement is making us look better (by his own admission). He has tried to bully and belittle the members both black and white on a regular basis. I have had personal experience with this on more than on occasion. He constantly lies in the press attempting to make the Firemen look bad. Ex. NYE he didn’t mention that some members were on AL or 60% of EAB members were on SL. Did you hear about the planned sick out I sure didn’t. Show me the last time he was in public speaking positive about the rank and file. Rubin did a lot of things wrong but he was always in front of the camera talking all the good things we had done (probably for his own agenda)

            In the end you will say what ever he wants and refuse to see what 90% of the department sees.

          • Really Disappointed

            unfair exams? what were they, to hard? please!

      • Really Disappointed

        400 years! really! how many of those years were you oppressed? so sick of that. i did not oppress anybody! nor did any of my co-workers. get over it. yes, my white ancestors were terrible racist! i cannot change that. you have not been mistreated! if anything, you have been given a leg up, AKA “cadet program” so don’t go playing the victim on here. as I’ve said before i have many black friends on the job, most of whom are excellent fireman. my wife is also african american. she also thinks your opinion is horrible! grow up!!!!! i guarantee your uniform looks great but i wont see you inside when its on!

        • xray

          let me start by saying this isn’t the 60’s,70’s, or early 80’s when plates were thrown in the trash. Times have changed for the better in this department.There are a lot of members on this job who call black or white there friends INCLUDING MYSELF.What I can’t seem to understand is this.I wasn’t a fan of Rubin,but At the same time I recognize his deeds good and bad.When you can’t or refuse to recognize anything positive of someone’s work,there’s gotta be something more insidious to it. Im quite sure if you been on this job long enough you’ve seem me inside on every type of call. So stop with the cliche of someone wont do this or do that.Maybe it’s you who won’t go inside.That’s such a lame A@@ responce I haven’t seen no one in my time just sit outside while their company went in.You need too stop telling horror stories.Oh and yes my uniform does look good because I take PRIDE IN MY JOB.It’s not about the letters DCFD on my back,I genuinely believe in what we are doing here, providing service to the public.For the record I don’tt know you and I didn’t call you a racist.But I believe our department still has issues that need attention.

          • Twin Tower

            This department most certanily has both white and black racist members (one who is charge). Will it ever be perfect, no. I would just like to see the working conditions better. LRB just wants to get revenge on people. Why would he START the fight about DCFD? It was just ot aggitate people.

            Oh and what were all the positives he brings to the table?
            I’m all for the uniforms looking better but the needs to be some times that t-shirts are allowed or short sleeves during winter. Other than that he has done nothing. Never once praising them members in public.

            Lstly, Great job on the PIO. A lot of these stories would just fade away with decent PIO that get out in front instead of refusing to issue a statement!

          • Anonymous

            BRIAN where are you?

          • Really Disappointed

            xray, your defending someone who is an obvious racist. i dont get it. if you genuinely want to believe in something, why not believe in the guys to your right and left. as for my lame a@@ comment. if you can’t spot the coward on the fire ground, YOU are the coward! thats truth. i would just like to see the department rise up against lrb, not because he’s black or white, but because he’s incompetent and trying to divide us. dont be a sheep. think for yourself.

  • OldGregg

    aint nobody got time for dat….

    She is doing more for fire prevention than you think!

  • haveyouseenmybaseball?

    @Welcome to our world:
    That long bar at the bottom of the keyboard, you know, the one with no writing on it, it’s called a space bar. When you push it, it makes spaces between words and after punctuation, makes posts A LOT easier to read.

    • Welcome to our world

      Ok I didn’t kno that..thanks for the tip (rite)


    Hey Dumb Dumb….uniform compliance…out of all that King Clown has done to tear down the moral fibers of this great department….all you can talk about is uniform compliance…..when fires blowing out a few windows you’re the guy hiding behind the apparatus door tucking in your shirt, making sure your in compliance and while you’re tending to your fashion duties, the fireman are inside going to work….you also sound like the 1/2% who follows Ellerbe and kisses the ground he walls on…..better yet…you probably were in attendance at his State of the Department F up when the only thing King Clown could say was…we’ve improved our uniform appearance and our apparatus is now open 24/7…..WOW WEE GEORGE….those are some remarkable achievements….guess what dumb dumb….when your out patroling the streets following apparatus because of who’s in it and make things such as this the focus of your day….its no wonder the only thing you can talk about is how you improved the uniform appearance……a person making close to 200K per year and these are the only things you can speak of….if that isn’t enough to know your a complete and utter failure…than I don’t know what else to tell you…..

    So keep pressing your shirts and hem you pants to FEMS specs…oh and don’t forget to uae a lint roller on your sack coat and leave the grunt work to the fireman…….mayne you and Ellerbe could form a fashikn design company, because its quite obvious you haven’t a clue about the fire service….

  • Ol Skool 86

    What a relief to finally get someone on our side.thanks MPD. everything that’s happening in the Dcfd is criminal anyway. Watch out MPD, our administrator doesn’t like to be questioned, he will try to get police officers demoted next…

  • Ron Stuart

    Shows that Dave dosent work as moderator- or dosent care. That vid is out there to make fun of African Americans and you know it. The white Lt at our firehouse thinks it is the funniest thing he has ever seen, and mumbles under his breath “stupid fucking n-ggers”, which is the entire reason you put it on HERE. It has nothing to do with Lon Walls or anyone else in DC. So you get real toolbag. Dave? Reading this? Stop appealing to the Fox news idiot mentality please….

    • dave statter

      To be honest I am not really sure what you are talking about. Fill me in.

  • xray

    I’m speaking lif@ Twin Towers, I’ll agree with your first paragraph that if you come to work on time do your job you wont have a problem.What you left out and most important is to also follow orders and be in compliance.What is so hard for members to follow policy set by your superiors.No one said you have to like it,but when you took the oath here…you basically said you would follow the rules as set forth by your superiors.Now I have to disagreee with you regarding the cadet program.The program within itself has been very successful.There are chief officers,capts,Lt,ect…within our ranks who are doing quite well (not to negate recruit accomplishments).You say I follow the chief because hes black,well I wasn’t a big fan of chief Thompson…last time I checked I think he’s still black.I follow a person’s ideology and their work ethics.As I stated before NO ONE AGREES WITH ANYONE 100% OF THE TIME,and no leader is perfect.But ask yourself have we done all we could in support of our chief.I may not have cared for Rubins style of management,but I SURELY WOULD NOT HAVE TURN MY BACK ON HIM IN PUBLIC,VERY DISRESPECTFUL.I’m speaking life as proof,I have never been disrespectful to a superior and have always treated everyone fair.That’s why I’m hard on members being disrespectful and being insubordinate.You must learn to follow first before you can be an effective leader.

  • xray

    @ ANONYMOUS, you know where to find me why don’t you stop by so we can have a face to face talk

    • xray

      Oh and by the anonymous thats not how I spell my name since you want to put it out there< honestly stop by sometime.